Separation Anxiety: How to Help Dogs Who Hate to Be Alone with Malena DeMartini
We chat with separation anxiety expert Malena DeMartini to find out what it takes to help dogs and their guardians with this issue.
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Listen to episode 49 of The Pawsitive Post in Conversation wherever you get your podcasts (Apple, Spotify) or below, watch on Youtube or below, or scroll down to read the show notes and highlights.
How to help dogs with separation anxiety
If your dog has separation anxiety, what can you do to help them, how can you cope with not leaving your dog alone for longer than they can handle, and why is it so important? We're joined by separation anxiety expert Malena DeMartini to talk about how you can help your dog with their separation-related issues.
We talk about:
- what separation anxiety is and whether other labels like separation-related distress are useful to dog trainers and dog guardians
- what it means to suspend absences for your dog
- how video helps to show the moment when the dog starts to get distressed, and what happens before that
- why it's important to speak to a vet about medication for separation anxiety
- how crates are not the answer for dogs with separation anxiety
- how dog trainers can become certified to work with separation anxiety cases (CSATs) through Malena's school
- And at the end, Malena tells us about a book she loves
Malena DeMartini is a Certified Trainer and Counselor (CTC) and a Certified Dog Behavior Consultant (CDBC). Since 2001, she has specialized exclusively in canine separation anxiety, having worked hundreds of cases and constantly innovating to find better ways to treat the condition and support guardians, other trainers, rescues, and shelters. Malena is the author of two ground-breaking books, Separation Anxiety in Dogs, Next Generation in Treatment Protocols and Practices (2020) and Treating Separation Anxiety in Dogs. is the founder of the prestigious Separation Anxiety Certification Program (SACP), which has graduated hundreds of Certified Separation Anxiety Trainers (CSATs) across the globe. She also has an online self-paced course, Mission: POSSIBLE, which is an invaluable resource.
Learn more at https://malenademartini.com/
The book Malena chose is The Dot by Peter Reynolds.
Highlights of the conversation with Malena DeMartini
Z: Let's start with the question of what is separation anxiety for people who might not know.
M: Yeah. So separation anxiety, first of all, it's a little bit of a misnomer. If I had my druthers, I probably would change what we call it, but obviously separation anxiety is the familiar term publicly and even to some extent in the research.
So if it were up to me, I would call it separation phobia.
And basically these are dogs who are suffering from fear, anxiety and stress when left alone. And the reason I mentioned that word phobia as a, as a potential title is that by definition, phobias are very irrational to those individuals that are not experiencing them, but very real to the individual who is in this case, the dog. Right. So we typically are like my, I come home every time. Why is my dog so upset about alone time?
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| Separation Anxiety in Dogs |
And so it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to us, but it is incredibly real and generally terrifying for many dogs to that suffer with this to be alone.
K: I think in the sort of the dog training realm, I've seen, just going back to your conversation about what would you call it? I've seen discussions and I'm not a separation anxiety expert. I refer as fast as you could possibly refer if someone came to me with the question about it.
But I've seen, you know, people talking about different labels, maybe different differential diagnoses. Is this a useful conversation? Does it change practice? You know, I'm thinking I've, I've seen terms like isolation, distress and, and this kind of thing.
M: Yeah, this is a great question and I actually want to start with the beginning piece of what you said about so many terms, so many labels.
Separation anxiety, as I kind of mentioned, is really the more familiar term with the general public. The research really has a number of different ways to identify this sort of syndrome of dogs that are suffering and distressed when alone.
The more commonly used terminology now in the research is separation related behaviors or separation related problems. And so that's what we're seeing come up more often. But still the general public is going to refer to it as separation anxiety.
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| Treating Separation Anxiety in Dogs |
Isolation distress is an interesting label because we actually don't see it in the research. It is sort of a fabricated term that has become popularized in the general language of our industry and with the general public.
And while all of the terms are sort of synonymous with a similar type of intervention, isolation distress does, even though it's not a clinical diagnosis in any way, shape or form, does have a different meaning behind it.
So the difference between separation anxiety and isolation distress is simple. So separation anxiety, understand, understood by the general public is a dog who needs their primary caretaker or primary caretakers, maybe two people or so, to be present in order for them to be comfortable.
Isolation distress, conversely, is they need a warm human being with them in order for them to be comfortable. And I would say that rarely do I see dogs that are entirely on one end of the spectrum or the other. They're somewhere in the middle. Some dogs prefer their, their primary caregiver, but they're okay with some other people.
And, you know, so there's somewhere along that spectrum. And I think the real difference that comes in practice between those two is simply that those that really need their primary caregiver in order to be comfortable. We need to help those dogs expand their circle so that that circle of people that they can be comfortable with is bigger than just the one or two individuals, but the actual implementation of the day to day training and the gradual systematic exposure of to alone time is quite similar, albeit individualized to the dog in front of us.
Z: So when you're working with someone whose dog has separation anxiety, you ask people to suspend absences, basically not to leave the dog at home alone for any longer than they're comfortable with.
So what does it mean to do that? And can you give us an example of how you might work through a series of carefully timed absences or missions with people?
M: Yeah. Thank you for asking this question. I think it's such an important question for so many reasons.
If I just say to someone, well, in order to do this training, you're never, ever, ever, ever, ever going to leave your dog alone for longer than they can handle. It doesn't necessarily have to be with you individually, but with it has to be, the dog will have to be with someone. That's a big ask.
And I want to recognize and shout out like it is a big ask.
However, a couple things about that. It is a temporary ask because we're talking about not leaving the dog alone for longer than they can handle. And maybe today they can only handle one minute or even one second.
But with time and training and implementing a systematic protocol that will grow.
And so in time, we're going to be able to leave that dog for a half an hour and then maybe an hour and an hour and a half and three and four and whatever the goal may be. So it is a temporary request.
And the other thing I want to mention about it, which I think is super important, this is not, Malena got up on her high horse and decided people should just not leave their dogs alone.
The laws of learning are such that if we're trying to teach a dog that alone time is safe while simultaneously leaving them for very scary, overwhelmingly long absences, we are not going to make progress.
Management is an essential tool. And this is basically management. Managing absences is essential for allowing these animals to learn in a systematic and gradual way without continuing to expose them to this overwhelming fear.
So once the guardian has decided that they're ready to move forward, yes, we start to work with our clients with what we call missions. And that's what I started calling them, and it just sort of stuck. So, and a mission is created based on the individual dog, their environment, and their caretaker, their primary caretaker.
So never will you see, I'm going to copy today's mission from Buddy's workbook to, you know, Fluffy's workbook.
There will never be the same two missions for different dogs. And the way that those missions are created is that we observe the dog in real time during a brief alone time absence and determine at what point in time that dog starts to show us signs of escalating indicators of distress. And that will allow us to create criteria based on that individual dog's needs.
Based on that observation, we write one day, just one day of training. And that that Training takes about 20 to 30 minutes. It's comprised of maybe 10, 11, 12 steps each individual tiny little exposures.
And the guardian, the client, will write some notes as to what they observed during that mission. And based on those notes, we as the trainers will say, oh, this is what they saw.
So this informs me as to what I'm going to do tomorrow in my training session for this client tomorrow. So as you can imagine, this is very customized and tailored to the dog, to their environment and to the individual client.
But it's also allowing for the dog to set the pace of the protocol. And I think that's the most important thing about getting separation anxiety training, right?
Because if you just go on the Internet and say, how do I fix my dog with that suffers with this issue, it'll say gradual exposure, start with a minute, then go to 3, then go to 7, then go to 10. And that formulaic or algorithmic kind of percentage increase is actually what can lead to the opposite of desensitization. Desensitization's evil twin, which is sensitization, which is worsening of the problem.
K: I like how you sort of woven discussion about the video, which is about our next question. Um, so you, do you use a lot of video?
And as we were considering like asking these questions, I was reminded of my favorite instance of sensitive separation anxiety videoings. I was fostering this dog who was a new tripod, but somehow had managed to escape out of like six foot pen.
So we were thinking, oh, God. This new tripod was, you know, climbing out of this giant wall of a pen. Maybe, maybe it, the dog has separation anxiety.
So I asked the CSAT friend of mine to do an assessment, you know, and I got in the car and drove away and we were on the phone and she was like, Kristi, so an orange dog jumped up on the table in front of the camera.
So she was like, worried I was going to be upset or something about this because one of my sled dogs liked to sit on the table when no one was around and like just got in the way.
And it ended up that the tripod did not have separation anxiety. So it was all good news.
M: Oh, good.
K: I always laugh at that idea of just how gentle she was as a practitioner. Just being like, Kristi, just so you're aware there's an orange dog on the table. And I'm like, oh, I got pictures of that already. It's okay. That's a daily thing.
M: It's all good. Yeah, yeah.
K: So I think you touched on this a bit, but just a little bit more so in a little bit more depth. What kind of signs are you looking for that a dog is okay?
You know, she looked for signs that this dog, this tripod was okay. What would she be looking for?
M: Yeah, this is a really important question. And I'm sorry to say it's going to be a dog trainer. It depends kind of an answer, but I will follow up with the it depends.
So we are looking to identify the sort of general point at which the dog is no longer comfortable with alone time and is showing signs of distress, signs of fear, anxiety and stress.
And when we observe a dog, there are indicators that they are approaching that point. Oftentimes we refer to that as threshold. I refer to it as the threshold of stimulus aversiveness because there's multiple thresholds that can be identified and, but that's the one that we're really wanting to be ensured that we're, we're identifying for the purposes of creating criteria.
So what I really have to be careful with, and that's why I say it depends. It would be really very easy to say, well, once the dog is barking or once the dog is whining, or once the dog is jumping up on the door and scratching, then I know that he or she is distressed or those are the signals I'm looking for. But it's so individual to the dog in front of us.
I can tell you, I have watched dogs who lie on their bed staring stiffly at the door and just profusely drool. That's a very different presentation than the dog that is, you know, tearing at the door and barking and howling and whining.
And yet both are showing us signs of extreme distress.
So it's not an actual type of indicator or symptom, if you will, that we're looking for. We're looking for the actual escalation in frequency or intensity that is getting towards, oh, this dog is now really distressed.
And the way that I try to identify this with your average caretaker is, you know, when you look at your dog and you, there's a point at which you go, oh, wow, my dog is absolutely freaking out. Okay, technical term here, freaking out. So you, your brother, your, your cousin, everybody says, yeah, that's for sure. Freaking out.
Well, what happens before that? And then what happens before that? And then what happens before that? And we get to a point where I identify that was the point at which it started to escalate in frequency and, and, and intensity toward the dog was, quote, freaking out.
So that's what we're watching. And not necessarily a specific symptom because some dogs won't ever whine or bark.
Z: I think that's really helpful for people to know. And then there's another thing about separation anxiety, which I think some people struggle with. I mean, it's such a hard thing overall for people to deal with, but many dogs are put on medications by their vets, and we hear some people concerned or having, you know, questions about that.
So none of us are veterinarians, but what do you say to clients about the need to speak to their vet about separation anxiety?
M: Yeah, well, as, as you just mentioned, none of us are veterinarians. And so, you know, obviously I'm very careful with the discussions that I have with my clients. I, I want the decision to ultimately and importantly be resting with the veterinarian and the, the client themselves. It is not up to me in either direction.
What I do think is important, however, is from the very beginning of a protocol or from the very moment that they're concerned about their dog's alone time behavior, I think a, I think a caretaker should inform their veterinarian, and if they haven't recently had a thorough examination and vet check, they should do so.
The majority of the time, yes, it is simply alone time behavior that's a problem. But there are differential diagnoses. There are different types of medical issues that can present in a way that look very Much like separation anxiety. So we want to make sure that those are being ruled out.
And I like to have the vet as part of the team and collaborating from the very beginning, because at some point in time, when the vet feels ready, when the client feels ready, when the dog is showing signs that they may need some pharmacological support, then we're ready to. They're ready to have that conversation if and when that happens.
The other thing that I like to remind clients, because there is some hesitation, like the most common comment that I get is, well, I don't want my dog's personality to change, or I don't want them to be a zombie. I don't want to drug my dog.
And so I like to remind guardians that the purpose of medication with separation anxiety is to enhance learning and retention. It's not to, like, dope the dog up so that they don't care about being alone.
It is truly to enhance that learning and retention so that when these gradual exposures are being incorporated, the dog can now learn more efficiently and retain better. That alone time is safe.
K: Yeah, I love that framing. Seems like it would be very useful for clients to understand. Yeah. So another thing that we sort of see, I think maybe less discussion from other trainers, but often from dog guardians is, is the crate question.
So what's your gut reaction to crating in this context of separation anxiety?
M: In this context of separation anxiety, yes. And I will make a caveat. There are great purposes for crates, one of which is very near and dear to my heart because I happen to live in fire season, Northern California.
And evacuating, you have to have your dog in a crate. And so, you know, I think it's important that we all take some time to expose our dogs to be able to be comfortable as best as possible in a crate.
But absolutely, unequivocally, there is just so, so much evidence and support for not using a crate for separation anxiety training. The majority of dogs that suffer with alone time behavior problems have simultaneously experienced or do experience confinement anxiety.
And the amount of sort of exacerbated issue that will happen if we're taking a dog who is distressed about being alone and then taking that overwhelming fear and confining it to a very small space, appropriately appropriate space or otherwise. This can really make for a much more difficult process.
And many dogs, quite frankly, many dogs will not easily get past alone time plus confinements.
And I want to make sure, though, that people understand, because the number one reason that people say, well, I have to crate my dog because my dog is destructive when alone. And I understand that, right? I understand, like, I need to protect my valuables, my property, my items in my home.
But two things about that, number one, that threshold that we talked about, we're always in this type of training, staying beneath that threshold, that anxiety threshold. And the reason that these dogs are destructive when and if they are, with respect to separation anxiety is that's their outward manifestation of this extreme level of anxiety is to chew and to scratch and to, you know, destroy things. If we're continually staying beneath their anxiety, then there will be no need for the dog to create destructive, to have destructive behavior.
So I want people to really remember that about, like that, that need to have a crate because they're destructive. But we're not going to be reaching those destructive behavior levels because we're not exposing them to absences that are inciting anxiety.
And the other thing I want to say that I think is really important, if there's some concern like, well, the dog sometimes gets into the garbage and I, you know, or when alone, or the dog does sometimes chew the table legs, just, you know, not just out of anxiety, but it's an adolescent, you know, or whatever, I really want people to think about, let's not confine the dog within a space.
Let's confine the dog out of spaces. So put the X pen around the garbage can, put the X pen around the table. Put the laptop in, you know, and desk and, you know, in a crated or gated off area. As opposed to confining the dog, we can find the items that we are, you know, concerned that might be interrupted.
Z: I love that way of looking at it. Very much helpful for the dog.
M: And also helpful for the human. Right? If I have put a crate over my garbage can, I can be rest assured that those chicken bones that are somewhere in my garbage can cannot be chewed up by my dog because they cannot access it.
Z: Great. So you run a course for trainers who want to learn how to work with separation anxiety cases. And we actually see some amazing trainers graduate and become CSATs. So please, can you tell us something about this course?
M: I will. You know, I have to share this story because I think it's kind of funny. And Kristi, you mentioned this right when we started, like I refer as quickly as I can when it comes to.
So in 2013, I had already been specializing in this and in this behavior issue for, you know, 12 years. And I kept getting requests like, you know, write a book or teach a class. And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, you know, just was the furthest thing from my mind. But I did a large presentation and we had several hundred people there.
And I remember this is what inspired me to change my, change my tune and sort of go ahead and write a book and go ahead and start a program. There were multiple, multiple people in the room.
And I asked the audience, raise your hand if you're willing to take and work with a client that has very mild, you know, distress about being alone. Handful of people that raised their hands. And I was like, oh, that's really great.
And then I said, now keep your hand up if you're, if you will work with clients whose dogs have received landlord complaints, are destroying the household, are, you know, jumping out of second story windows, urinating and defecating around the house, you know, et cetera, et cetera. So these more severe appearing, if you will, cases.
And it was like, oh, hey, there's the one lady in the back. Fabulous. Thank you.
So I realized that it was such a, almost pariah of a behavior, right?
And it made me recognize that there was very little help out there for your average caretaker that was, you know, had this problem with their dog. And so I decided to start the program.
And I laughed, laughed, laughed. Veronica Boutelle, of Dog Biz, and I talked about getting this program started. And I said, it's going to last one session because everybody knows how to do systematic desensitization.
And she said, let me know at the end of this program if you, you know, because how it went. Because she said, I am looking forward to laughing at the fact that you have no idea what you're starting here. And I was like, okay.
And now, 11 years later, you know, we have almost 300 certified separation anxiety trainers around the world. But I think what's important here to talk about is what the program offers. It's a 15 week program and it is very, very intensive and quite comprehensive.
And the one thing that I think, well, many things about the program that are. That are really worth highlighting, but the one thing that I would really like to highlight is that it is a virtual one on one mentorship with a very small number of students per class.
Every single assignment, which is very often in the course of that 15 weeks, receives individual feedback, lengthy individual feedback, quite frankly, from me, where I'm pointing out, this is great and how can we adjust this? And I see where you were thinking about that, but why don't we bring in this other element and it's individualized to each student because every student brings a different, different lens to this program based on their background and experience.
So it's sort of like a group process that is, that is really mentoring each individual student. The feedback loop that we support throughout this program is just constant. It is a constant, constant means of communication and feedback. Both directions.
And I love to honor each individual student's abilities and thoughts and questions.
There are webinars and lessons that are released every Tuesday and Friday and then every Tuesday and Friday we also meet to talk about the previous lesson. We meet for an hour and a half collectively.
It is live. It is not a self paced course. There are no automated, like take this quiz and then you pass kind of thing. It is really intense.
And I say that not to scare people away but to, because I, I feel like dogs deserve that. Dogs that are suffering with separation anxiety deserve that level of expertise, care and skill when from a, from a certified separation anxiety trainer.
They deserve that kind of specific, customized, individualized, tailored to that dog in front of them support. And one of the things that the students learn in our program is how to work with clients five days a week, how to track tons of data.
Then that data drives the information, the information from the data drives our criteria choices. Right.
So it is a very data driven process that is also quite driven by the human element and the relationship that we uphold with, with our clients. So it's a pretty intense course that takes a, takes a lot out of everyone.
I don't say I'm proud of many things, but I know that I feel very proud of the program that I run.
Z: Absolutely. I think you should be. I think it's made such a difference and it's so good to be able, like Kristi says, to refer people to CSATs for separation anxiety issues.
This transcript has been lightly edited for content and style.
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